Favorite Workouts of Fast Talk All-Stars, Part 3

Fast Talk all-star guests including Dr. Iñigo San Millán, Dirk Friel, and Ben Delaney reveal their favorite workouts.

Ben Delaney cycling uphill

We ask every guest of Fast Talk—coach, athlete, or scientist—to describe their favorite workout—the what, why, how, and when.

In this episode, we share the favorite workouts of legendary physiologist Dr. Ed Coyle, coach Jeff Winkler, pro off-road racer and coach Hannah Finchamp (who has since married and become Hannah Otto), coach Julie Young, physiologist Iñigo San Millán, TrainingPeaks cofounder Dirk Friel, and cycling journalist Ben Delaney.

As each guest describes the specific details of their chosen workout, notice that it reveals a bit about their training philosophy and the “style” they bring to the execution and prescription. 

For more workouts of Fast Talk All-Stars, check out part 1 and part 2 of this series.

Episode Transcript

SPEAKERS
Dr. San Milán, Hannah Finchamp, Trevor Connor, Dr. Ed Coyle, Jeff Winkler, Chris Case, Dr. Stephen Seiler, Ben Delaney, Julie Young

Best Endurance Workouts

Chris Case 00:11
Hey everyone welcome to another episode of Fast Talk, your source for the science of endurance performance. I’m Chris case sitting today with Coach Trevor Connor. As always, we’re going to do another favorite workouts of Fast Talk All Stars Episode today. It is January. It is base season at least in North America it is so we wanted to tailor this mostly towards that but doesn’t mean everything that we have here is ride your bike slow type workouts.

Trevor Connor 00:42
Oh, absolutely not. There’s some good high intensity workouts in here and getting a little high intensity in the base is a good thing.

Chris Case 00:48
Great. We have an all star lineup as we always do. Let me go through the list, we have Derrick Column, legendary physiologist Dr. Ed Coyle, coach Jeff Winkler, pro-rider Hannah Finchamp both on mountain bikes and gravel she does it all, and a coach herself. Coach Julie Young former pro, roadie and does a little bit of everything now on in terms of racing and coaching, legendary physiologist and coach and Iñigo San Milán who’s been a longtime fan and member of the crew here at Fast Talk, coach and founder of training peaks Dirk Friel and friend of ours, bike journalist and tech guru, Ben Delaney. So a range of physiologist, coaches, athletes and regular guys.

Trevor Connor 01:37
It’s going to be a lot of fun, some good workouts in here.

Chris Case 01:41
Let’s get to it. And let’s make it fast

Trevor Connor 01:50
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Dr. Ed Coyle Discusses the Benefits of 5×5 Workouts

Chris Case 02:42
Alright, this first workout comes from Dr. Ed Coyle, it is a 5×5 tell us about the specifics of this particular 5×5 Trevor?

Trevor Connor 02:51
Well, first I gotta say it’s been really interesting asking all these coaches and physiologist their favorite workout because I would say the one that we get the most is the 5x5s. But there are different variations on this, you’ve heard mine, which is more of a threshold effort, Dr. Coyle’s is a little harder than that. Now we’re getting into what people would call those VO2max intervals. So I wouldn’t necessarily do these in December or January, but they are something that you could bring into your training as you’re getting towards the end of that base season.

Chris Case 03:22
Very good. Let’s hear from Dr. Coyle.

Dr. Ed Coyle 03:25
My favorite workout is 5 times 5 minutes at 95% of VO2max, you know being a runner, that would be a standard workout running one mile, under 5 minutes. Doing that 5 times, for a cyclist you can do it on trainers, and that’s probably the most easiest way to do it. If you you’re able to really control your power output, because 90% versus 95% is a big difference in how hard it is.

Trevor Connor 03:57
You really want to keep all 5 right at that 95%.

Dr. Ed Coyle 04:01
Right.

5×5 Recovery

Trevor Connor 04:02
What’s the recovery between the intervals?

Dr. Ed Coyle 04:04
4 to 5 minutes, usually.

Trevor Connor 04:06
What physiologically are the benefits of these intervals?

Dr. Ed Coyle 04:10
It’s going to raise VO2max, it will probably be the most effective, enlarging the heart and making your heart stronger in pumping blood for raising stroke volume, and it’s the specificity of training you’re having to recruit both slow and fast twitch muscle fibers to complete the workout.

Trevor Connor 04:35
Great, and then final question related to the workout is what time of year is the best time to do these intervals?

Dr. Ed Coyle 04:41
You know, they’re usually done in the latter-half of the preseason and then up until the season starts, right up until you’re probably two or three weeks from your main competition.

Trevor Connor 04:53
So this is kind of getting you ready for being on peak form type interval?

Dr. Ed Coyle 04:58
Exactly, yeah. You’d be following those with shorter duration, higher intensity intervals, going 2 minutes at 105% of the VO2max or the 2 minutes of it, for a runner running 800 meters in 2 minutes and 5 seconds, 2 minutes and 10 seconds.

Cycling Coach Jeff Winkler Discusses his Thoughts on Workout Techniques

Chris Case 05:17
Alright, let’s hear our next workout, and this one comes from coach Jeff Winkler, big gears. Tell us more, Trevor.

Trevor Connor 05:24
I loved hearing him say this, because this is one I’ve talked to a lot of people over the years and heard mixed opinions on this. I’m a big fan of big gear work. I used to go out and just do long rides grinding out 60 rpm and I’ve been told by some coaches don’t do it’s the worst thing in the world. Other people said, yeah, there’s some benefit to that. So it was actually quite surprising. We asked Jeff Winkler, what’s your favorite, and he’s like, go out and do 5 hours at that low cadence, which I was like, Oh, thank you. Nice. But let’s, let’s hear what he has to say. I think there’s some benefits to this.

Chris Case 05:57
Great. Here’s Jeff.

Jeff Winkler 06:01
Probably, I’m gonna date myself a little bit here because this was really important when I was in my career, when I discovered this technique is, for me, the over geared endurance work is, I think something that’s missing from a lot of programs and athletes really benefit from if it’s a regular part of their program. I remember discovering that on my own in the 90s and wishing I had learned that some years before, because I felt like it really transformed the kind of rider I was. I mean, we mostly know what that means but I remember how I found out about it, was watching a world tour team that was in a training camp in San Diego, and they would ride 2 by 2, for 5 or 6 hours in the 5315 and never change gears and you know, you’d roll up. I mean, they wouldn’t go up 15% grades, but you know, they would go uphill in that gear and so then they’d be grinding at 50 rpm, and then when it was flat, they’d be rolling along the 25 miles an hour, you know, or whatever. And in terms of strength endurance, and having good legs late in races, I mean that was a really fundamental workout that I came to appreciate.

Trevor Connor 07:15
So as I was gonna ask, what do you feel are the benefits of that workout?

Jeff Winkler 07:20
Yeah, for me, when I really practiced it, which was funny enough, was kind of after the peak of my competitive years, where I just kind of got to the point where I was like, well you know, I’m really not interested in doing structured intervals and so I would just go ride 4 hours in like the 5315 or 14, and going fast and ended up doing some very long rides, where you’re going like 25 miles an hour for, you know, 100 miles of solo. That year, I raced my last year, and ended up winning multiple races in long solo breakaways that I’d never done before. That was not the kind of rider I was earlier and the way it expressed it was you could go hard early in a race and not feel as much fatigue late in a race.

How to Achieve a Target Cadence

Trevor Connor 08:06
So how would you execute this? Is it as simple as just go out and do a long ride and keep it in a big gear? Is there any cadence that you’re targeting?

Jeff Winkler 08:13
Back in the day, it was done primitively, which was like the stick it in a gear and leave it kind of approach. I think today with all the sensors and the, you know, collect, you can get cadence, you can then you have two approaches, you can either go the old school route, or say, I often will give it in terms of blocks and just say, let’s do 15 minutes, 30 minutes, what have you and keep the cadence in a range. So then you’re using your gears and it opens up terrain that you wouldn’t have in the old school method.

Trevor Connor 08:46
What sort of cadence? What’s the range that you would typically prescribe?

Jeff Winkler 08:49
Well, I can say what I did back in the day was probably not low by some low standards today. I know, you see some of the triathlete workouts, especially on some of the services, where they’re in the 50s. I probably never had extended periods of time in that, that low, but I would say 70 to 75 was, I mean, but you might do that for four hours, you know, as opposed to like a 15 minute block or something like that.

Trevor Connor 09:15
Okay. Finally, how frequently should an athlete do this? And is there a best time of year to do this?

Jeff Winkler 09:21
Yes, that’s a good question. I’m going to sort of, again, resort to my historical experience. Towards the end of my career, I actually did all of my endurance work like that. Now, that’s not to say that there weren’t times during those rides where I was at 85 or 90 RPM, but generally speaking, I was pushing big gears in all my endurance rides. I didn’t find that seasonally it mattered that much. I would do it. If I could do it I would do it kind of thing, and since I never was a, you know, you never had weeks and weeks off the bike you were never to where you had to ease back into things that much.

What does Coach and Athlete Hannah Finchamp Look For in an Endurance Workout?

Chris Case 10:00
Our next workout comes from Hannah Finchamp, coach and athlete, her’s is a criss-cross, over-under interval. That’s a mouthful, Trevor, tell us a bit more about this.

Trevor Connor 10:10
So on paper this would look like something that we recommend against, which is that overly complicated workout where you’re doing maybe a 15 second effort, and then a 1 minute effort, and then 20 seconds effort or whatever it happens to be. But I really like her explanation of why she says to do this, which is over-unders hurt, they are a hard workout. So she likes adding some variety into it to just make it more manageable to make it a little more fun.

Chris Case 10:38
All right, let’s hear from Hannah.

Over-under Intervals

Hannah Finchamp 10:41
My favorite workout are over-under intervals, something that most people are probably familiar with, but I also like to come criss-cross intervals, because I think that criss-cross allows for them to be done a lot of different ways. So you know, the over under might typically be 2 minutes above threshold, 2 minutes, just below, you know, maybe 3 times 12. crisscross intervals, I think it can be done in many ways. So maybe it’s 4 minutes at sweet spot, 2 minutes at tempo, you know, for 30 minutes or something like that. So I really liked those crisscross intervals or anything that goes back and forth and keeps me really entertained in that way.

Trevor Connor 11:24
Do you have a particular crisscross interval that you really enjoy?

Hannah Finchamp 11:28
Yeah, I mean, right now, I would say, you know, we’re kind of in that base time of year. So I would say I really enjoy 30 minutes, 4 minutes at tempo, 2 minutes at sweet spot, just continuing that pattern for the full 30 minutes.

Trevor Connor 11:47
Okay, and what time of year, would you do that workout?

Hannah Finchamp 11:50
That would early season? Yeah, during probably, you know, mid to end of your base training period.

Trevor Connor 11:59
And this is something you can definitely speak to what would be the physiological gains you would get from these intervals?

Hannah Finchamp 12:06
Yeah, I mean, sweet spot and tempo are still technically going to be aerobic, because they’re under that threshold. So you know, you’re still going to be making some of those aerobic gains, and you’re going to the goal of this is to increase your threshold. So increase the intensity that you can hold while still staying, I like the term to keep it really simple, is just under control. You know, I think we’ve all done those intervals where it feels like you’re standing, sitting, standing, sitting trying to hit the numbers, but when you’re truly under a threshold where you’re just like, man this hurts, but I could do this all day.

What are Julie Young’s Thoughts on Workouts?

Chris Case 12:50
Alright, the next workout here comes from longtime contributor, Julie Young, she’s taking us off the bike. Trevor, tell us more.

Trevor Connor 12:59
Well, you know my bias on this, and it’s good to hear Julie have the same bias, which is cyclists in particular need to get off the bike need to do this sort of strength work. I think it’s critical, I personally do it all year round, but at the very least, you need to be doing it through that base season. So I think it’s really good to hear from Julie talking about the importance of this and giving a little bit of guidance on how to do this.

Chris Case 13:22
Excellent, let’s hear from Julie.

The Benefits of a Plyometric Workouts

Julie Young 13:25
So, thinking like off the bike is, I wouldn’t say I don’t think it’s that unique. But I am just a huge proponent of strength work and I typically like to build my workouts into circuits. So you know, we have like, a lower body, upper body and and a stretch or perhaps a plyometric and I think that keeps it just you kind of move through the workout. I mean, obviously, it’s depending on like the amount of resistance you’re pushing in terms of recovery. But I think just kind of circling between those three exercises allows you the recovery, as opposed to just sitting and waiting and I think it keeps it a bit more stimulating. So I’m a huge fan, not that it’s unique, but I love like a Romanian deadlift, and I love like single leg Romanian deadlifts, and then mixing that with like an upper body work that you’re, you know, having to balance so like a single leg, like in hurtle step, kind of military press type thing. So just kind of in a workout engaging like balance and posture and keeping it more stimulating, and then you know, as I said just coupling that with some sort of, you know whether we’re doing some sort of stretch as that kind of rest period, and in some cases maybe throwing in a set of plyometrics. So that’s for me, like my favorite type of off-bike workout.

Trevor Connor 15:02
So what would be an example of a plyometric workout?

Julie Young 15:05
I mean, I think it depends. So could be, you know, whether you’re using the the med ball and you’re like you’re rotating, and you know, in an athletic stance and exploding through the hips, so you’re getting that full extension through your hips. So for folks that maybe plyos don’t really, they’re not well tolerated on the body, like the jumping and landing. That’s a really good one, to still get that explosive activity through your hips, or, you know, just simple things like a box jump, and I actually really like with the plyos, and really, like any sort of squat is for doing like double limbs. If we’re doing for example, like that box jump to put like the mini band over the knees, so it’s cueing the Glutes medius, for those good kind of mechanics on landing and takeoff. But I think also with plyos, obviously, you just want, you know, good foundation of strength in place and good. You know, I think the early phases of strength you’re working postural control and good limb alignment, or that good, good loading of the joint, but and then you know, phasing into the those plyos and not necessarily doing plyos right off the bat. And thinking about like, you know, maintaining that good postural control on on landing and those soft landings.

The Benefits of Circuits with Workouts

Trevor Connor 16:25
Great. So you touched on this a little bit that what is the benefit of doing this as a circuit?

Julie Young 16:30
For me, you know, again, obviously, it depends on on the amount of resistance, you know, and again, as we get into the more demanding part of a strengths program where you know, max strength and power with more velocity. But, you know, for me, I just, I think it keeps it more entertaining, as opposed to like doing a set of squats and just sitting and waiting, you know, you’re kind of you’re working in different muscle groups. So you’re allowing, the legs to relax, and recover, and then maybe you’re doing like upper body. Then again, kind of moving them to a stretch, again, you’re doing something active, but you’re you’re also allowing for that recovery.

Trevor Connor 17:09
Right? And do you feel that the sort of strength work is something you should do all year round? Or is there a period of time when you should not be doing this?

Julie Young 17:18
I mean, for me, I feel like I hate to call it an offseason. I know, we also call it a transition season. So you know, immediately after the summer, competitive season, you know, that’s really the time we like focus and invest in strength. That becomes more of the structured work of the training plan. And I do feel like that is a great benefit for year round training is just allowing these, these times of the year where we can dedicate to these different objectives. For me, like the fall, early winter is the time to really invest in the strength program. And that’s, you know, in my planning, it’s typically you know, about a 16 week program. But then I think, you know, in my opinion where the science has changed, I know when I was racing, I worked with Dr. Testa, I don’t know if you guys know Dr. Testa, but I adore Dr. Testa. He’s amazing, but he did not believe in strength because like he basically said, you know, once you make this investment offseason then you start riding your bike and you quit then you lose it. But I think we’re the science has changed is that you know if we can make this good investment in this, quote, offseason, and then do just, you know, minimum one day, like, one good day, you know, where it’s concise. It’s 45 minutes hitting the big muscle groups. You know, that’s enough to maintain and build on that investment. Then obviously, it depends like what’s going on in the race calendar. You know, maybe there’s times where there’s not a bunch of racing, so maybe you can do like a good day in the gym, and then maybe a good plyo day, you know, but I think just continuing at least one day, through the season allows you to build on that investment.

A Message from Stephen Seiler

Dr. Stephen Seiler 19:00
Hi, I’m Dr. Steven Siler. I gotta tell you, it’s a thrill for me to have the opportunity to go in and see a whole collection of my lectures and webinars all in one place, free of charge for the members of Fast Talk in the broader sports science world. And not only me, but other sports scientists have collected their work in fast our laboratories is presenting it for all of you to use and learn from every day.

Dr. Iñigo San Milán Discusses His Ideal Workout Model

Chris Case 19:37
Alright, our next workout comes from Iñigo San Milán, this is a zone 2 workout. And he’s talking zone 2 in a 5 zone model. Tell us a bit more, Trevor.

Trevor Connor 19:48
So, I got to share a bit of my story, which is many, many years ago, I went to get tested by Dr. San Milán. You know, I was happy with the test results but he said here’s something you really need to do and he introduced me to this concept of the zone to ride, no, or he called it an aerobic threshold, right, I believe at the time. So I had always done my volume work with very low intensity. He was talking about, there’s this value of variety, just below that aerobic threshold, it’s a very hard interval to execute. I brought that into my training, which was something I had never done before and was surprised at the gains I got from it. But I’m also going to say, and he’s going to talk about that execution. Even though this sounds like a pretty easy thing to do, the execution is actually really hard.

Chris Case 20:38
Excellent, let’s hear from Dr. San Milán now.

Dr. San Milán 20:42
I mean definitely, I’m a big defender of zone 2, right. Also, I really like that the athletes can get good sensations. That’s what I enjoy when I get back to someone like today and I see his numbers, and he tells and I ask him, how were the legs today? He says, good, really good. That’s what I like, you know because it makes me feel good about that workout. Again, yeah, good zone, too with a few, you know, intensity efforts that’s a good training right.

How is Zone 2 Demonstrated in a Workout?

Trevor Connor 21:14
So describe the execution of a zone 2 ride, is it you’re trying to average in that zone? Or is it you’re really trying to sit steady in that zone?

Dr. San Milán 21:22
Yeah, that’s a good question. I would definitely be steady there, right? Because this is a little bit of some, you know, especially when you do look at some of the partitioning, right of the zones, you might say, oh wow this guy has done a good zone 2 overall but you can get there by doing very high intensity and very low intensity, right? And the average is to about being steady there.

Trevor Connor 21:47
How long should it be understanding that for somebody like, today it’s gonna be very different from or average listener? How do they know how long to go for?

Dr. San Milán 21:55
Yeah, so I think that for many people, like myself, I don’t have much time, you know like, one and a half hours or so it is really good enough for your level of cycling. Right? Obviously, I’m not going to go to my friends or anything trying to upgrade my category anytime soon. So, just wanna stay fit, or even improve my fitness. Right? So, yeah we’re gonna have the best job for whatever I’m expecting. If you want to category one, and you want to go into programs, definitely, yeah you need to do longer periods, right? Like, you need to do 4 or 5 hours in sync with with professional athletes. Right? I will say, though, that you know, if you do go 2 the real zone 2 for 7 hours, oof, it’s going to be really hard on you, and you’re going to be pretty destroyed the next day. So this is another reason to people think that is easy. But it depends. It’s easy for me but for world class athlete it’s a really hard day of training, because zone 2 is really hard. We’re talking about, you know it depends on the athlete, it could be 280, 300, 225 watts for 4 or 5 hours. Right? That’s really, think, I mean, I cannot do that for even 5 minutes. Right? Let alone 5 hours. Right, so this, is why everybody’s different and this is what, you know you need to dial in the exercise intensities, specifically to each athlete.

Trevor Connor 23:26
And how frequently should you do this?

Dr. San Milán 23:29
So yeah, I think that it depends on the time of the season. Right? But I’d say that, you know to maintain, you need to do like 1 to 2 days, and then you know, to improve, you know, like 3 days. It’s a good time 3 to 4 days a week.

Dirk Friel Explains His Special High Endurance Workout

Chris Case 23:47
Alright, following on the heels of Dr. San Milán’s workout we have a workout from Dirk Friel. And it is also in this aerobic threshold genre. Tell us more, Trevor.

Trevor Connor 23:57
Yeah, he gives a little bit of a specific way that he does it, but it’s the exact same thing that Dr. San Milán was just talking about of riding right at that right intensity and keeping it steady and Dirk likes to use a climb for it. But I think he even says right at the start that this is actually surprisingly a hard workout to do.

Chris Case 24:16
Alright, let’s hear from Dirk.

Dirk Friel 24:19
My favorite is also one of the hardest, which I dream of doing sometimes but I wish I would do it more often but in Boulder, I love that we can take advantage of changes in altitude and I love aerobic threshold workouts and building that aerobic engine. So I love going from if people know the routes around boulder you start at the Greenbriar and go up Lefthand Canyon, and end at Brainard Lake and that’s just at 10,000 feet and you’re starting at 5500 or something. So what I like to do is, I’m gonna set a goal to just stay at my upper zone to heart rate you know for me It’s like 148, I have a low heart rate, and I’m 51 years old. So 148 I try and target that and, but I might start out with wattage, you know it’s not 148 in the first second, right so I might start out with, Okay I’m going to target 280 Watts, heart rate gets to 148, I’m not gonna look at watts, I’m just gonna maintain good cadence, you know good 148, right around there, if I can. And then the altitude is gonna kind of create that decoupling, not, you know, fatigue will create their decoupling, but altitude will even accentuate more. As I gain that aerobic fitness, I see that decoupling become reduced and I can maintain a higher wattage at the same heart rate. Hence, this is why we train and I love that workout, and I love seeing that improvement over time. So that’s my favorite workout to do.

Benefits to Dirk’s Favorite Workout

Trevor Connor 25:58
So what do you feel is the benefit to this workout?

Dirk Friel 26:02
Well, it’s a test, as well as a workout. So I do love putting these tests into training programs, and the athlete doesn’t know it’s a test, if you call it test day, that has big ramifications sometimes. So sometimes, this workout is a test and it’s a personal test for me. So I get to hopefully see improvement, not always, but then I love the quality of that workout, it’s such high quality, but you have to maintain this self discipline to not go too hard, because your watts are going to drop. Yeah I might be a 210 watts, by the top, and you’re going slow. Riders are going to pass you there’s 80 riders a day, at least going up Lefthand Canyon that are very good riders. So I might be going very slow up the steep parts, and maintaining 250 and then 220, and who knows at the end, but that should degrade less, as I improve my fitness. So I just love the quality of the workout and it’s a self test.

Trevor Connor 27:08
Okay, so the two other questions. How often would you do this and is there a particular time of year or this is all year?

Dirk Friel 27:15
This being a test, maybe only 2 or 3 times a month, I think I can take the numbers and then that becomes more than half of my training. You know again, it’s like the discipline to take those numbers, to put them into training. And you can’t just stop 30 minutes, every 30 minutes for coffee stop break, right you got to have this consistent, ongoing kind of zone 2 aerobic threshold that has to be consistent and no breaks. But yet you can’t go too hard or therefore you’re gonna have too much lactate and different energy system, etc, etc. So that’s kind of a mainstay of my training is to to build that amount of time up over the progression of my training at that zone 2 threshold.

Ben Delaney’s Ideal Workout of Choice

Chris Case 28:06
Alright, let’s turn our attention to the last workout that comes from Ben Delaney and this is maybe one of the more fun ones. It’s certainly what a lot of people want to be doing all the time but tell us more about the kind of the unscripted group ride, if you will, that Ben lists as his favorite.

Trevor Connor 28:24
This is like that chocolate cake after you’ve eaten a really healthy dinner. I feel, I’m with Ben, I love group rides. I wish I could say best training in the world is go out and do a group ride every single day. Because I would do that, it’s not the best training, but there’s a real value in getting in those group rides somewhat regularly, both for the the mental and fun side and also to get some good intensity. So and I think that’s the message that Ben’s trying to convey here.

Chris Case 28:54
Excellent. Let’s hear from Ben now.

Ben Delaney 28:57
My favorite workout is a group ride, it is not a scripted, 5 minutes on 4 minutes off at this intensity, that it is going and doing group rides where it’s a fun interactive thing where I’m just focused on staying on the wheel as best I can and getting a higher intensity workout than I would normally be able to get by myself. So here in Boulder, Colorado I like doing the stages Tuesday ride, Turnt up Tuesday, typically end up behind people who have number plates still on their bike from racing and riding, in way over my head, and end up getting a high quality workout in because that or in COVID times. It’s continued on Zwift racing. I love doing Zwift racing. 45 minutes is a long one, just great threshold super threshold stuff.

Trevor Connor 29:52
So what are the benefits of doing a group ride or train race?

Ben Delaney 29:57
Well you get back, depending on the type of the event you could back in, what the goals are, the benefits are, you know like a long weekend group right is like that’s all good zone 2 stuff right? But like the Zwift training race is all threshold, it not all, it’s largely threshold and above. So you could say that’s like doing an over under type workout, which I’m doing it by myself I would, I would block it out as intervals and it’s just a lot more fun. If I’m chasing somebody or trying to get away from somebody than just looking at a computer.

How to Make the Most Out of Group Rides

Trevor Connor 30:29
So do you have a particular way that you try to ride them to make sure you’re getting the most benefit or just go and have fun and don’t think about it?

Ben Delaney 30:35
Mostly go and have fun and don’t think about it, you know? Like then the Zwift does categories by watts per kilo and I’m kind of in no man’s land between B’s which tops out at 3.99 watts per kilo and A’s which is 4 and up. So B races I’ll try to win A races I just tried to not get shellacked, that’s the strategy. – Okay -. Just play you know.

Trevor Connor 31:02
So let’s get to the when is this stuff that you do all year round? Or is there a particular time of year that you really use us at a time of year that you wouldn’t use us?

Ben Delaney 31:11
Pretty much with Zwift, pretty much year round, yeah, tuesday’s you know, started with stages, it’s just Turnt up Tuesday is a tuesday thing and get some ideas. If you’re doing racing or longer rides in the weekend, you take monday off and then tuesday, come back and punch your buddies, absorb their punches and go from there. Go back to the desk. kind of dizzy for the afternoon but full of endorphins.

Trevor Connor 31:32
Perfect. Okay, nobody has given us a group ride yet. So that’s good. Yeah, is this a weekly thing or in terms of the group rides to try to get one in every week?

Ben Delaney 31:41
Yeah, at least one a week for sure. Yeah, trying to make it every Tuesday. I get salty if somebody schedules a work meeting over Tuesday lunch but weekly whenever possible, for sure.

Chris Case 31:55
That was another episode of Fast Talk. Subscribe to Fast Talk wherever you prefer to find your favorite podcasts and be sure to leave us a rating and a review. The thoughts and opinions expressed on Fast Talk are those of the individual. As always, we love your feedback. Join the conversation at fourms.fasttalklabs.com to discuss each and every episode and become a member of Fast Talk Laboratories at fasttalklabs.com/join to become a part of our education and coaching community. For Dr. Ed Coyle, Jeff Winkler, Hannah Finchamp, Julie Young, Dr. Iñigo San Milán, Dirk Friel, Ben Delaney and Trevor Connor. I’m Chris Case. Thanks for listening.

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